Emerald start up help, update, managed to start it.

[Fishy Dave]

Hello,

 

I sold enough things on ebay to justify buying a new Emerald K6, and feeling optimistic have booked in with Circuit Motors to have the mapping done this Friday.

 

I'm having difficulties getting the initial set up right to allow the engine to start. The ECU is connected to my laptop and has a red light showing on the Emerald. Pressing the starter button turns over the engine, but it won't start and the the red light remains on when the engine is cranking.

 

I am using the config and map which came with the Emerald and is listed as 1.6 SS with 4- 1 exhaust and standard throttle body. The config file shows it is set to 36-2 Rover 1.

 

My actual spec is 1600 Supersport which had been EU3, converted back to EU2 with distributor and running the 1400 Flywheel (guessing this is 36-2?).

 

In the start up instructions it mentions resetting the throttle position which I did. It suggests checking pins 11 and 28 for live current. Well, pin 11 shows 12v with the igntion on and no ecu connected. Pin 28 shows no voltage, is this correct?

 

Next it mentions checking shielding to the crank sensor and checking if between 0.8 and 1mm distance to the trigger wheel. How likely are either of these to be the problem?

 

All help gratefully received.

 

Thanks, David

 

Edited by - Fishy Dave on 3 Dec 2010 17:20:06

[Allen Payne]

I'm someone will be along soon with better information but the 1400 flywheel generates different timings than the 1600 - I think you'll need to use a base setup for a 1400 engine

[SLR No.77]

Also check that the immobiliser function in the Emerald software is disabled.

 

Stu.

[Fishy Dave]

Thanks for the suggestions so far, the immob function is off. The 1600 config they have sent me has the distributor option and 1400 flywheel selected so guessing that should be ok?

[Racingshoe]

The red light will turn green once it recognises the crank pattern as the engine turns over.

 

If it stays red then your engine is not turning over fast enough to generate a pattern, or the pattern is wrong in the Emerald config. If both of these are ok then check your crank sensor.

 

-----

Rik Robarts - C7 DNF the future's bright, the future's no longer orange though.here

[Mankee]

Should the trigger signal not be 36-4?

[oilyhands]

Try each of the Rover patterns in turn, and reset the ECU each time you change. If the red LED doesn't turn green when cranking then the ECU is not seeing the crank trigger pattern as configured. If all settings fail, then check the wiring from poins 31 and 32 to the crank sensor for continuity.

 

If you go into the live adjustments screen you should be able to see the RPM monitored as you crank, if it shows zero or alternates between zero and a number then the pattern is wrong, if it shows numbers all the time but still doesnt go green then your cranking speed is too slow.

 

Oily

[Fishy Dave]

Thanks again all,

 

I tried the other Rover configurations, resetting each time, but the light remained red. Returning to the orginal Rover 1, 36-2 setting now gives me a flashing red and green light on cranking (showing 0 revs on live adjustment). It mentions this in the start up guide, and as you mentioned Oily, the polarity of the crank sensor may need reversing by swapping pins 31 and 32? Cut wires, or should i prise the wires out of the connector?

 

Thanks, David

 

David Smitheram, Wiltshire (South) Joint AR, 07718 368173.

1600 supersport race car www.racelife.co.uk

[oilyhands]

Just prise the wires out at the ECU end, a very small jewellers screwdriver prised in will flip the tag and the wire should pull out.

 

The other possibility is that your cranking speed is too slow or the sensor is on the edge/bent/misaligned.

 

Oily

[oilyhands]

Thinking about it, a few weeks ago I had a similar problem and it was a problem with the king lead of the coil which was rogered, this was creating some EMF interference which basically stopped the crank sensor from working correctly.

 

To diagnose this, disconnect the coil and the injector harness and then crank, see if you can see RPM in the live adjustments screen. If the LED comes up green then you can easily diagnose the issue. Connect the coil and try again, then connect the injectors and try again.

 

To diagnose cranking speed too low, remove the plugs, remove the injector harness connector and the coil connection and try cranking while watching for engine speed in live adjustments, it it comes up green then there lies your problem.

 

Oily

[Fishy Dave]

Thanks Oily, will try that. I have the crank sensor from the other engine still so could give that one a go (the other one has two mounting screws rather than one on the current fitted sensor).

 

David Smitheram, Wiltshire (South) Joint AR, 07718 368173.

1600 supersport race car www.racelife.co.uk

[Fishy Dave]

Well, with the help of both Oily and Emerald I have managed to get the car started! Took some hours though. For the benefit of others in the future who may search for help.....

 

I reversed pins 31 and 32, and this just returned me to a solid red light on the Emerald whilst cranking. It took me some time to work out how to prise the wires out of the connector 😳 eventually helped by Myles site showing that the white cover to the connector is removable! Swapped the wires back as they were.

 

I removed the crank sensor, cleaned it, put it back and tried again. Still the same, flashing red and green.

 

Added my jump pack to the battery to give it a bit more oomph, still no luck.

 

King lead pulled off the distributor, cleaned connection (it was clean anyway). As Oily told me, no way of knowing if the king lead is broken without replacing, so had to hope it was ok.

 

Oily then suggested I remove the spark plugs, disconnect the injector wiring and remove the king lead and try again. YES! That worked and I had a solid green light on cranking, with the starter motor whizzing around at about 280rpm on the live adjustment screen. At least this showed the trigger pattern of Rover 1 was correct.

 

At this point Emerald phoned me and suggested I post it back to them for them to check or make adjustments. I thought i'd press on as I had the day off, and continued with advice from Oily, feeling slightly guilty that I hadn't bought the Emerald from him. 😳

 

Added just the spark plugs back into the head and tried cranking again. Back to flashing red and green on the Emerald 🙆🏻. Oily mentioned that the 1400 starter motors are not always strong enough to turn the larger engines over quick enough for the Emerald to be happy. The other alternative is that the battery isolation wiring is sapping voltage, so Dave suggested connecting a wire direct from the battery to the starter motor. A quick hunt around my garage didn't produce any suitable cable, so I connected the jump pack to the starter instead. This did the job, and the car fired into life for the first time and settled to an idle about 1200rpm.

 

I had to switch off quickly as the crocodile clip was touching the manifold and would have melted. So, rigged up the jump pack to the battery and tried again, it instantly fired up so I let the engine get upto temperature for a few minutes. I did try touching the throttle a little but this stopped the engine, oh well. So, lastly i disconnected the jump pack and for a third time the engine fired into life after a couple of seconds.

I'm guessing it started this last time either becasue a warm engine was easier for it to turn over, or maybe the Emerald recognised the engine this last time having started up just minutes before?

 

So, should I look to replace the starter motor, the wiring to and from the cut out switch or the battery? The battery is about 3 years old (Halfords sealed unit) and the starter motor is a reconditioned unit I bought about 18 months ago. The wiring to the cut out switch is original.

 

HUGE thanks to Dave (Oily) for patiently helping me with this today, even when I disturbed his lunch!

 

Cheers, Dave

 

David Smitheram, Wiltshire (South) Joint AR, 07718 368173.

1600 supersport race car www.racelife.co.uk

[jchasey]

Glad its up and running now Dave!