Want to sprint next year...

[pete_h]

Hello,

  I'd like to do the sprints next year. Is there a novice co-ordinator? Could someone explain the difference between Class 4 and 5? I have a k series r400, which I would be planning to drive to the events. 

Cheers,

Pete

[AG2728]

Hi Pete

I did my first (albeit short) season this year and 12 months ago was asking the same question.

I have a 420R and was unsure which class I should be looking at. I ended up choosing to compete in Class 4, the road car class.

In this class I knew I would be using list 1B tyres (ZZS) whatever the conditions, whereas the higher classes had greater choices/options. One less distraction for me as a newbie to think about.

In class 4 i don't need a FHR device which would also probably entail a new seat as my original Tillet appears incompatible with a couple of FHRs I have tried. I do think they are a very good idea but didn't want any more initial expense as I put my toe in the water. FHR is mandatory in Class 5.

Class 5 (modified specialist) is limited to 210BHP but weirdly Class 4 (roadgoing specialist) is not limited at all. No idea why, but that's how it is.

Your car would fit into either class, both of which were under-represented for 2020 but to roll up, do an event and drive home, I think Class 4 sounds the ticket.

Just go for it. I should have done it years ago. It's a blast!

Andy

[pete_h]

Thanks Andy - Class 4 does sound like a good fit, and like you said I can avoid the expense of new harnesses and possibly seat without the need for a Hans device (although I think I have one somewhere....). Did you drive to the events? Or am I mad? Would have a 'support car' with me to carry tools etc (I hope...!)

[mandalman]

Hi Pete

 

Whereabouts are you based? I'm In the same position. Really interested in sprinting but I have never done any, having only bought my superlight R earlier this year. Curborough Sprint course do novice days. A full days tuition as an intro to the sport. This year they are on May 4 and September 2. If the circuit isn't too far away (staffordshire), the May novice day might be worthwhile before the season gets underway too much

[garybee]

It's excellent fun and with a really great group of supportive people.  Don't let not having done it before put you off.  I'm sure you will be able to find a 'buddy' to guide you on the first couple of events.  There used to be a system to partner new entrants with experienced competitors for precisely this reason.  There's a good chance it is still the case of course.

PS - I think you should do it.

PPS - Give it a go.

etc

[Comp Sec]

Hi Pete

I think Andy has convinced you to enter class 4 which is the correct recommendation particularly as you want to drive your car to events.

Class 4 comes under the MSUK Road Going Specialist production rules and is for any road going Caterham too powerful for classes 1, 2 and 3. HANS devices are optional and you are limited to list 1B tyres of which Avon ZZS are the popular choice.

Class 5 comes under MSUK Modified Specialist Production rules under which HANS devices are compulsory and you can use tyres from list 1c. These tyres are not really suitable for road use.

We don't have a Novice Coordinator at the moment but Andy has given you some great advice and has almost volunteered himself as your mentor at your first event! 

You are not mad to drive to events, many of us do it when we first start. I did it for my first few seasons.

If you want to talk through your options please give me a call. (Also mandalman)

The club is running a novice day in September but that may be too late for both of you, if you want to join in this season there will be lots of help and encouragement both before and at the events. Go for it!

Class 4 could be a lot busier this year.
 

 

[AG2728]

Pete

I've sent you a PM.

I didn't drive my car to events last year but it transpired that most of the events that were not cancelled due to COVID seemed to be miles away from me as I am up in the grim North. To be honest after my first outing at Curborough, I was so hooked that distance became irrelevant to me and I entered everything I could, packing 6 events into a shortened season..

For example, Wiscombe Park being a 6 hour drive is almost in another country for me and is closer to Paris than it is to my house.  There are many others who drove their cars there and back to events, so yes it is well doable. 

Next year there should be several more local events that I would probably choose to drive to. Don't get hung up on being able to carry loads of tools so much as there will always be someone willing to let you borrow stuff.

Andy

 

[mandalman]

Hi Graham

Thanks for the encouragement. Unfortunately i am going to have to limit myself to just getting a taste at a few  mid-week sprint and hill climbing schools this year. Unfortunately competition dates all seem to be on a Saturday or Sunday which clash with my main job as an event caterer so until I retire  or take a back seat from the day-to-day running of my company I'm not going to be able to compete. 

 

[ECR]

In a normal year there are usually occasions where a small group of Sevens hire a sprint venue for the day for testing/playtime  mid week (Curborough for instance). That would give you plenty of time in the seat and the ability to get a feel for the ambiance of a real sprint meeting. Keep an eye on Blatchat

[mandalman]

I certainly will. My normal weekend is Monday/Tuesday but being my own boss I do have flexibility so long as I'm not at an event. A lot of the novice days and schools are in the week and so far for nextr year I have booked onto  Shelsley Walsh (April 20), Curborough (May 4), Prescott (May 26), Lotton Park (July7) and Curborough again (Sept 2). I'm also hoping to get to the club novice track day at Castle Combe in April when the date is announced (fingers crossed it doesn't clash with anything). For the time being those, track days and any mid week club sprints will have to scratch my itch.

[pete_h]

I'm starting to gather bits for next year, and am thinking I will need a spare set of wheels to run ZZRs on for the events. Should I be looking for CXR 7" and 8" or would standard 6" and 8" do? If anyone has any spare sets for sale... just missed out on a set :-(

[Richard Price]

Pete,

185 and 215 ZZRs would be fine on 6 and 8" wheels.

Why do you need a 2nd set of wheels? What tyres do you currently have?

If you're planning on driving to events ZZS's may be a safer compromise. If its wet, ZZS's are significantly better than ZZRs, but in the dry, I'd say the difference is very small.

[CharlieC]

Watch out, Andy. It looks like there's some competition is coming to Class 4 (already Hans device ...) 

Regards driving to/from the event, I have done this for a couple of seasons in my SV (often with a companion) and we have worked out a good system for packing (with a fair bit on my passenger's lap when there's two of us). It's fine and feels great to be doing it in a 'Corinthian' spirit, which was after all, the idea for the Lotus 7 in the first place.

It also lessens (but doesn't eliminate) the risk of driving over your own bonnet ... sorry Andy, couldn't resist 

[AG2728]

It also lessens (but doesn't eliminate) the risk of driving over your own bonnet.

How cruel of you. I was trying to forget that incident. 

[CharlieC]

only because you went faster than me in the final event!

Hope you have a super Christmas and I look forward to seeing you on track next year.

Best, Charlie

[AMBO]

Greetings all!

Am looking at joining in for 2021! 

Road legal 2001 car with 225bhp, so assume class 4.

It has the roll bar with one diagonal brace which I understand is ok for club trackdays, but advice on whether it's ok for this please? Have got a petty strut to fit...

1B tyres.... although having looked at the regs I'm a bit confused as somewhere it implies that and 1A, 1B or any road legal tyres?

Need suitable helmet, suit and gloves as minimum. Have got a timing strut.

Pay the £30 registration fee and acquire a MSUK RS Interclub licence.

Have just got a trailer and will sort a tow vehicle...

Anything else please?

Thank you, Nick

[Richard Price]

Nick,

Yes. If your car has 225bhp and is road legal then it will fit in class 4 as long as your tyres are included in either list 1a or 1b.

These lists are included in section L of the MSUK yearbook.

See here :-

https://www.motorsportuk.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/motorsport-uk-yearbook-2021-p210-218-permitted-tyres-l.pdf

And the full yearbook here :-

https://www.motorsportuk.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/motorsport-uk-yearbook-2021.pdf

What tyres do you currently have fitted?

 

Yes. You'll need to have the petty strut fitted with your FIA roll bar.

'sounds like you're otherwise OK

[Simon.Rogers]

Richards points are correct but I will just add that the Tyres MUST be on the list.  Not all Road Legal tyres are on the lists.

A road legal tyre may be in list 1C or even not on the list at all.

[Comp Sec]

In fact it is any E marked road tyre and list 1a and 1b, this is what the regs say:

"Tyres to be any road legal E-marked radial tyre or listed in the current Motorsport UK General Regulations Permitted Tyres (L) Lists 1A and 1B"

The tyres on your car now are likely to be on List 1B and it's probably a good idea to use what you have when starting out. Richard gave some good advice in post #12.

The petty strut will need a manufacturer's homologation sticker. If it doesn't have one please ask for further advice.

Sounds  like you are ready to go. Please feel free to contact me if you need any more help.

Hope to see you at some events next year.

[AMBO]

Thank you gents for the replies!

Currently it's fitted with CR500's, 175/55R13 and 205/55R13's. I will check and see if they are E marked and if so, my understanding is that they will be ok. If not ZZR or ZZS in 185/55 and 215/55 seem popular, or any other road legal E marked or 1A or 1B tyre...

The petty strut is a used item which hasn't landed here yet! It's allegedly a Caterham part, but I don't remember seeing any stickers on it, in the photos...

Does the roll bar look like an FIA item? Not convinced myself, but would like a definitive answer! Doesn't have any stickers therefore do I need to add...https://caterhamparts.co.uk/track-day-bars/2728-roll-over-bar-fia-s3-l-a-rhd.html

Thanks Nick

[Richard Price]

Nick,

Your CR500s will be E marked and are included in list 1b so they should be OK.

Your roll bar is the earlier FIA bar, where the homolgation label will have originally been fitted to the roll bar rather than petty strut. The FIA bars were made by "Arch Motors" who should be able to supply a replacement if you don't have the label.  The later "track day" roll bars (as in the link you show) are made by "Caged". The two roll bars use quite different petty struts which are not interchangeable.

[AMBO]

Thanks Richard! Will await arrival of the strut and go from there and will contact Bruce at Arch 

As it looks like I can use the existing tyres and roll bar, I won't be too disappointed if the strut turns out to be wrong and I have to sell it on and buy another!

Your help is appreciated!

[andy_harries]

Rather than create my own thread, I thought I would add to this one....

Also thinking about doing some sprinting in 2021 but confused by which of the MSA licences that I would need.  Is it just the RS Clubman Licence or one of the others?

The club regulations state: 

1.3.1 Entrants must be fully paid-up valid membership card holding members of the Lotus Seven Club and in possession of a current Motorsport UK Entrants Licence. 

Looking on the Motorsport UK site there isn't a licence called "UK Entrants Licence", and "Chart 26: Competitors Minimum Acceptable Licences" from their website would suggest that a Clubman licence is not sufficient for sprints or hillclimbs.  So I would need to look at a 'National' licence which would need a vision test and a medical report I think?

 Unless I have missed something?

[Nigel Fox]

You need an RS Interclub licence which says on it "competition driver/entrant"

The medical stuff is a self declaration.

[andy_harries]

Ah, thanks.

Looks like from the guidance that as I'm 42 but haven't held a licence before I need to have a vision test to apply.

I must say, the guidance on the Motorsport UK website could be a lot clearer than some small notes section that's buried  in section 4 on the licence application itself