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Adjusting Tillets & Swapping Cage for Bar


robsandbach

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Hello everyone,

After my first track day in the 7 I've decided to give the Tillets a second chance as a) they didn't seem to bother me driving to and from the track (1 hour each way) and b) I like being able to use the 6 point harness my academy car has fitted to it and hadn't considered that wouldn't be possible with the leather seats.

One problem I did have, which I've read is common, is my head being pushed forward slightly with my helmet on. I wanted to check that inserting these spacers under the front mounting bolts is a good first step to resolving that one and ask if anyone has any advice on how many might be required to angle the seat sufficiently? I wouldn't know whether to start with 2 or 10! I am assuming I would fit these spacers between the  "rail" and the floor on the furthest forward bolt on each side. Given I always have my seat all the way back, might this be a good time to just bolt the seat to the floor  for a bit of extra head clearance. 

Particularly pertinent because I am also strongly considering swapping the roll cage I have for an FIA rollbar. Given I am primarily using the car for non competitive track days and the odd trip through Wales I think I am comfortable with the increased risk as a tradeoff for ease of ingress/egress. I understand that I will need to "remove the rear suspension" to access a bolt for this - does anyone have a few tips as to what exactly that involves so I am not going in blind on Monday?

Thank you all as usual for any help :)

 

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I removed the runners and my Tillett is bolted to the floor, without taking the seat out I can't confirm how many spacers I used but it would be much nearer to 10 than 2. My spacers are between the Tillett and the aluminium box section.

As my car is a 1992 version I'll leave it someone else to explain about removing dampers as I'm pretty sure its a different set-up on a newer car.

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  • Member

Lots in the archives on all of those.

I'd search for:

  1. The risks of helmets near bars. Don't compromise on this. 
  2. Adjusting Tilletts, there are some numbers but I couldn't find a factor. And the problem of the bolt angle if you remove the mount.
  3. The right type of socket for the bolt with the thin head. You may need to buy or grind something suitable before you start.

Jonathan

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To access the bolts holding the cage you will need to remove the dampers. The top damper  bolt is accessed at the corner of the bulkhead behind the seats.

This will allow access the the bolts going up into the cage.  On an imperial car these will have thin heads and you need to be careful to use a socket which fully engages. On a metric chassis there is more space and the bolt head is not thinned down.

Make sure you get the right FIA bar for your chassis. A metric bar will fit an imperial chassis but not the other way round.

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Some great advice, thank you. I've read about grinding down socket to remove the chamfered edge - I'll work on that.

Johnathan - could you elaborate on the helmet near bars comment as it sounds relevant. At present my helmet rests against the "padding" (it seems as hard as the steel)  in the roll bar. Without that padding it would rest free! That was another reason to get rid of the roll cage to be honest.

At 5' 10" I had assumed the FIA roll cage would provide sufficient clearance?

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Why not keep the cage and run lowered floors, this seats you in a better position, and allows more adjustment of the seats and allows the benefits of a cage.

Having seen one members off where the cage enabled his passenger to retain his head and another's near miss where they were lucky not to loose there heads via a barbed wire fence I would not run without a cage now.

There are many many cars out there where the drivers head when running with a conventional roll bar is too high, this is checked for competition yet people seem happy to run like this on the road.....

Put this into perspective anything solid is going to damage your head, and were driving open topped cars so what ever set up you run you need to take precautions.

For my money lowered floors, correctly fitted 6 point harness and an SLR cage offer the best protection.

 

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I agree with what 7 WoW said, a cage and lowered floor is such a better solution, and have seen too many accidents whilst marshalling where an FIA bar is simply not enough, and I know you aren't racing but taking the cage off to improve access at the expense of personal safety is a step too far for me.

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Thank you for the further advice. It's not a decision I'm taking lightly and I am still considering which way to go.

I do have the lowered floors already so perhaps my seating position just needs adjusting and that will solve my clearance and head tilt problem. It could be the previous driver has it mounted high I suppose - I'll check.

From what I have read above though it would appear that with a roll cage I should wear a helmet whenever driving the car even on the road?

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There are many risks of open top Caterhams     

Sit yourself in the car and look at the clearences you have,

You have to draw the line somewhere, and  run with what your happy with, some run a helmet with an aero screen, some run Ballistic glasses, some just sunglasses, some run diagonal belt, some 4 point some 6 point, some ar happy with their head being the first thing to hit the ground should they roll other run lowered floors and / or cages.....

After all there's a proven arguement that running a helmet without a HANS device is equally dangerours........ next thing you know Caterham will be offering and aftermarket HALO.....

Everything is a risk you just need to look at them in terms of frequncy of occurance and severity.

 

 

 

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  • 1 month later...

Ok! I actually got started on this job today. The first time I have ever jacked up a car and removed tyres so a small victory. 
 

I was hoping someone could confirm the axle stands are in the correct / safe positions before I go to work on removing the seats underneath! Also the jacking point I used, based on my interpretation of the manual, was the central  knot protruding down where the two a frames meet a hinge. Just checking I got that right!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jiqt3cyhc0kwmor/Photo%2025-01-2020%2C%2014%2052%2015.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/na3hv5ijd4n5x1f/Photo%2025-01-2020%2C%2015%2004%2054.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/x6lj3m17pboy28g/Photo%2025-01-2020%2C%2015%2005%2000.jpg?dl=0

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Thanks Jonathan,

I had read the guide but struggled to get the axle stands right where the frame meets the tube as the top of the stands aren't wide enough to accommodate the nexus of tubes whereas slightly further back sits nicely within the "valley" on top of the stand. Would you recommend moving them there anyway?

Thanks for the ongoing support. I really am leaning as I go!

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Well I tried adjusting the location and ended up with them like this: 

ACC94373-4D5D-4BDD-A9E5-D2461EA2485E.jpeg.eba83fc4095257b7f374c29fed51eabf.jpegC12BECF6-99C7-432A-A24B-9890CD04F528.jpeg.b2d1ccc16d327501a00c443367d28aef.jpeg

I may take the advice given and adjust the profile of each stand's head. 

I managed to remove the front and rear bolts from the cage before the light faded. As I understand it the next job is to remove the rear dampers by loosening the bolt situated behind each seat's headrest. That lets me move the damper out of the way and access a bolt which, I assume, is going up from the bottom of the car into the roll cage? 

Its difficult to see anything as the trim panels in the boot area are all in the way - I assume there's no need to remove them?

cheers all!

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You'll damage the chassis powder coating, get some rubber matting on those stands!.

Remove the shock absorbers in their entirity, and there should be very shallow boltheads in the top of the turret holding the cage in. Be aware they are very shallow, 14mm I think, and its normal to just cut the end off a socket to ensure that socket slips on the bolt head fully, if you dont do this do take care as its very easy to round the bolt heads, needless to say if you do things can get difficult !

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