David aka Blue7 Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 I have just fitted a couple of replacement CR500 195x45xR15 tyres so next time I need new tyres it would have to be the ZZS 195x50 plus the hassle of adjusting the front cycle wings.A quick search of the blackcircles website for 195x45xR15 speed rating V produces 10 tyres, three of which are:Toyo Proxes T1-R £58 and £60Falken Ziex ZE-914 £65Goodyear Eagle F1 DSD3 £74Has anyone fitted any different makes of tyres other than Avon? I recall past references to fitting Toyo as alternatives but in the latest edition of EVO magazine, Toyo are bottom of the rating chart.I have also had two recommendations to fit Uniroyal tyres. I don't track the car and we sometimes get a bit of rain in Scotland :)David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brown Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 Blue, not a big problem adjusting the cycle wings unless you are at the tyre fitter and hopping to drive home. Just go for the ZZS as much more confidence inspiring in the wet than S500. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manstein Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 David is it just a case of elongating the hole for the front bolt to move the wing up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David aka Blue7 Posted July 17, 2017 Author Share Posted July 17, 2017 DavidI had a look at your tyres / wings, offsde had circa 5mm clearance and nearside wing was actually touching the tyre and I don't know how the rubber trim stayed in place. I have two concerns:1. Tyres so close to the wings could result in greater likelihood of the wings detatching from the stays when driving through standing water2. Moving the front of the cycle wing upwards will put additional stress on the rear part of the stay which is glued in place and could result in the wing detaching from Stay ... but I concede that fiberglass / carbon could maybe cope with the flexing.However, why should I have to modify the cycle wings just to suit Avon ... there are other suitable tyres on the market that are equal if not better than Avon.How did you get on with the rear shunt repair?Blue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
makingff Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 I fitted ZZS's to my CSR last year and have had no problems to date (touch wood) with the cycle wings or stays. Mine are carbon so, as you say, they flex which probably helps.The trickiest part of the job was separating the wing from the stay where it bolts on on the inside of the wheel as it's held additionally with Silkoflex. Once this was done though it was straightforward to get a suitable gap at the front and rear and reapply Silkoflex and bolt the wing in place.I did look for other makes of tyre at the time but could find nothing suitable for the rears so stuck with Avon.I prefer the ZZR's to CR500's - the ride is a bit harsher but all round a much better tyre in my opinion.Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David aka Blue7 Posted July 19, 2017 Author Share Posted July 19, 2017 Thanks for the info Simon, I am surprised that Caterham used Sikoflex on the front retaining bolt? I had been considering Uniroyal Rainmaster 3 as future front replacements but good point, they may not be available in the size required for the rear wheels ... I will have to check but I have a year to do so.David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Jonathan Kay Posted July 19, 2017 Member Share Posted July 19, 2017 NB There are a lot of different products branded "Sikaflex".Jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David aka Blue7 Posted July 19, 2017 Author Share Posted July 19, 2017 JonathanI agree and CC usually use windscreen sealant, however, what I find it very surprising that CC would go to the "expense" of applying sealant in addition to a bolt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
makingff Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 It may have been the previous owner, who had 'upgraded' the cycle wings to carbon, that applied the Silkoflex (or other similar product). I assumed that was how it was supposed to be so re-applied when I refitted. Re the rears, other than Avon, I could find nothing in 245/40R15. Let me know if you find anything!Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brown Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Blue, my near side wing had moved and I've now slackened and re-tightened. Off side fitted ok, all be it with a fairly tight clearance but both appear to run fine but clearance could be increased by elongating the hole further. Very much take your point regarding "recommended" sizes and can't understand why Avon increased the diameter. I would not be happy running a CSR with Rainmasters even if they fitted. I have not re-applied Sikaflex to the rear mount as there appeared to be enough flexibility to allow it to rotate the few degrees required. If it did come loose I think it would just slightly rattle as firmly bolted at the front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David aka Blue7 Posted July 19, 2017 Author Share Posted July 19, 2017 Hmm 245x40xR15 do seem to be a rare animal but my local tyre fitter said he would make some investigations, I will let you know if he comes up with anything.Boyd Stokes of Highland Caterham hire recommended the Uniroyals, he has at least one CSR in his fleet. I am no tyre expert but the Avons are probably designed for dry track use and I only use the car on normal roads ... that can sometimes be wet ;) and don't take bends at 70 mph so I probably don't require require Avons and something more suited to wetter conditions may be a more sensible choice ... I was quite amazed to see the label on the CR500 195x45 had an A rating for wet conditions ... I don't know how they are tested but that rating does not equate with my experience of CR500's in the wet.Well I have a year to make a decision and meantime take a closer look at that bolt through the front wing.Re your assumption of what may happen if the glued rear section came away from the stay, on my 2008 CSR the wing got twisted and constantly jammed between the tyre and suspension and it was very difficult to drive home. Although CC would never admit to there being a problem, I noticed that on my next CSR, they had reinforced the side of the wings with additional fibreglass applied to the right angle so that it wouldn't twist and when it did detach, it just sat on the stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brown Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Will add extra Sikaflex. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finmac Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 Thread resurrection! David/Blue did you ever change your tyres and how did you get on please?cheers Finlay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David aka Blue7 Posted January 21, 2020 Author Share Posted January 21, 2020 Hi FinlayCR500's are still being made and sold so I did a bulk buy with Boyd Stokes of Highland Caterham Hire, he has two CSR 200's for hire. So I have two CR500's presently fitted and two more in stock. Funnily enough, when on Harris last year I did wonder what I would do if a trye got trashed because the only "quick" option would probably be to get a ZZS 195/50 sent to the garage at Tarbert. Looking closely at my front cycle wings I think I might be able to fit a 195/50 on the passenger side but not drivers side because the rear of the cycle wing is already quite close to the tyre. So if the driver side tyre got damaged I could just swap wheels fit the ZZS to the passenger side. Not an ideal situation so modifying the front cycle wings is something I will have to consider in the future ... unless Avon reintroduce the CR500's again ..,. after 31st January Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finmac Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 Thanks DavidThis whole tyre business is starting to irritate me. Being quoted £630 for a set mail order then another £60 odd to fit means £700 for a set of Caterham 15” tyres is dearer than for my 19” tyres on my M4 BMW..... Plus to add insult they don’t even fit without making some mods, I mean who thought that was a good idea?!Is it only Avon that can be obtained in 245 rear section I wonder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team Shortshift Posted January 21, 2020 Leadership Team Share Posted January 21, 2020 Interesting to see Blue 7 (David) advising that CR500's are still available in CSR sizes. I have spent quite a bit of time looking for them, including talking to Avon themselves, BMTR and other places - all without any luck.I am now resigned to having to buy a set of new four new ZZS's and accept that I might have work to do to make them fit at the front. As I remember it, a ZZS is a size-for-size replacement for the old CR500 at the rear; it's only the fronts where a ZZS is larger (wider/aspect ratio?) than the original CR500 fitment.Incidentally, I have one un-used CR500 (rear size) sitting on my tyre rack. If I am forced to buy a new set of ZZS's then I would be happy to sell the single rear-sized CR500 if that would help anyone.James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David aka Blue7 Posted January 21, 2020 Author Share Posted January 21, 2020 I don't know where Boyd sourced them, originally it was going to be Avon but I think he eventually found a source in the Midlands somewhere. However, in the long run it will eventually require a modification. The suggested mod' of elongating the hole in the wing so that it can be moved upwards seems simple enough but I would have thought that in doing so it would just push the rear section of the wing down and put stress on the wing. I did have a quick look at the wing last year but couldn't shift the securing bolt because it looks like Caterham have added black silicone to the bolt so the head is actually stuck to the wing.It is one of the disadvantages of the CSR, there are alternatives for front, Toya seems to spring to mind but I have never found an alternative to replace the rears. I damaged a front tyre at the 60th at Donington, Avon only had ZZS and when I went to the Caterham crew, their advice was to remove the cycle wing and fit the ZZS ... doh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finmac Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 Looking at this a bit more you can indeed buy Toyos new in the correct size for the front - for half the price of ZZS. However it seems ZZS are the only tyre that will fit the rear.So mix and match and no mods or spend a fortune and end up having to make some mods. What a joke..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian B Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 Just to repeat what I posted on the other thread, in case anyone comes across this in the future.When I changed from CR500's to ZZS's on the CSR they just fitted under the existing front wings without modification, but it is close! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brown Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 Finlay, as I said before the offside ZZS fitted ok the nearside needed the front hole elongated. It must have put some strain on the Sikaflex glued joint as it partially came apart and I had to re-glue. Replaced rears last year but will have to get another front set before long. WheelsAround were cheaper ( but not hugely ) than CC but also included fitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finmac Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 Interested in what price the tyres were please David? Below quote from BMTR but also need to add in postage at £30 and fitting at £65195/50R15 - £111.65 + vat, per tyre245/40R15 - £140.07 + vat, per tyreCheers Finlay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David aka Blue7 Posted January 21, 2020 Author Share Posted January 21, 2020 I just can't find the email with price and I would just have paid over cash to Boyd. The price you show above looks reasonable and cheaper than Caterham. Fitting seems pricey though, I have paid half that price in the past but I use a mobile fitter that I know. I think read something here a while back that Kwikfit are usually very reasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7 wonders of the world Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 Nankang AR-1 can be had in 245/40x15 from Camskill if thats an option for you, more track focussed than road though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7 wonders of the world Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 or slightly narrower 225/45x15 R888R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brown Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 Rears were £156.48, fitted inc vat last year from Ronnie. Haven't priced fronts since 2017. "other" David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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