TomB Posted May 27, 2012 Share Posted May 27, 2012 Im getting really fed up with my fuel leak now. Today Ive refitted the pump (K series injection), with a James Whiting rubber gasket, blue hylomar on all surfaces, Loctite 242 (medium strength) on the screws onto the tank, then left it in the sun for all the sealers & loctite to go off. Early evening I put a couple of litres of fuel in the tank and propped it up to tip the fuel around the pump to inspect for any leaks before it goes back in the car. Its still leaking - its is dribbling from the bottom most fastener (6o'clock position) and from the hole that is in pump plate for the original Rover gasket locating dowel. This is the position from where it leaked a fortnight ago causing me to remove the tank. What can be causing this? The face on the tank doesn't appear distorted - Ive used the short edge of a steel ruler along and across the face in this area and it looks flat. The blind rivnut doesn't appear to be loose - I tightened a screw into it until it stopped and the rivet wasn't turning. Im struggling for what to try now. Im wondering about trying a new gasket - JW and maybe the Rover one. The JW one is now heavily coated with Hylomar after two failed attempts to seal it. I could replace the bottom rivnut and help seal in with Epoxy. At least my cracked on the filler neck has been welded now. Edited for typos! Edited by - TomB on 27 May 2012 21:49:08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted December 6, 2015 Author Share Posted December 6, 2015 Thread resurrection! Ive replaced my pump, and now I need to get it all sealed up again. I've used a James Whiting gasket with hylomar as James recommended. However fuel is pouring from the holes in the pump flange where the original gasket locating dowels are located again.Last time this happened I ended up using silicone rather than hylomar and I made it fuel tight. The silicone oozed out of the dowel holes and I gobbed plenty on the dowel holes, and it's stayed fuel tight. However, upon removing the pump recently I found all the silicone dissolved and in the bottom of the tank. As such I think I need to use something that is thicker and more of a sealant than hylomar, but doesn't dissolve in petrol like silicone Loctite / Bondloc 574 appears in the archives, who. I've used previous for joints in the engine like the sump. I am also wondering if the threads on the rivnuts or bolts are worn. Does anyone know what size/ type of rivnuts are used for the fuel pump? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7 wonders of the world Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 rivnuts on the early tanks were hollow, later ones i believe had blind rivnuts fitted - you could get these retro fitted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SM25T Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 If it is coming through the rivnuts ... can you put Hylomar Blue on the bolt threads. Do I recall the flange is thin ... so important not to overtighten the bolts ? Or is that the sender flange maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted December 7, 2015 Author Share Posted December 7, 2015 I think I've got blind rivnuts, and the fuel is coming through the dowel holes. So the fuel must be coming through a tiny gap between the pump flange and gasket, or the tank side and gasket, then out of the dowel holes. When I put the hylomar on, I squirted it on the faces, then thinned it out with a scraper to make a thin film on each side of the gasket. Maybe I should take it off again and gob more on and not spread it as thin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SM25T Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 Worth a try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Boy Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 When I replaced my fuel pump gasket with a JW version, I put mine on dry. No silicone or hylomar.I was over-cautious when tightening not to distort the tank so when I put some petrol in, it started to leak through so I tightened up the screws a bit more and leaking stopped. I'm guessing this doesn't necessarily help you other than to say that just using the gasket alone should work...unless I have been really lucky!?CheersDavid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted December 8, 2015 Author Share Posted December 8, 2015 I stripped it all apart last night. Ive cleaned out the rivnut threads with a new bolt modified with a Dremel to make a tap to clean all the old nutlock out. Ive fitted some new dome headed caphead bolts to help spread the loads more and now the bolts feel more secure now as the threads are not covered with multiple applications of thread lock. Finally, Ive put loads more hylomar on the tank prior to placing the gasket on, and on the gasket outside face prior to mouning the pump. Given how that sealer has oozed out of the interfaces on the outside of the pump, I more hopeful that Ive got a good seal this time. Not tested it yet with fuel, so fingers crossed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted December 13, 2015 Author Share Posted December 13, 2015 Seems ok so far, I've had 5 litres in the tank and it's been propped up for the last 6 hours with the pump fully submerged and no leaks for hints off leaks at all. Phew! I just hope the hylomar and gasket don't get eaten by bioethanol in fuels. Super unleaded for me now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SM25T Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 So far so good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted February 7, 2020 Author Share Posted February 7, 2020 Well, I’ll resurrect my own thread! I’ve put fuel in today, nearing the end of my rebuild. The engines all works, so that good, but I’ve got a fuel leak from the same place! So it’s tank out again, but how to cure it? I guess I need to inspect the gasket and see if it’s been dissolved by bioethanol. Maybe a new tank or pump cradle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Jonathan Kay Posted February 8, 2020 Member Share Posted February 8, 2020 ... dissolved by bioethanol.What has it been exposed to? Ordinary UK street petrol?What's the source of the gasket, and is there any identification on it?...Photos, please, as you dismantle.Jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECR Posted February 8, 2020 Share Posted February 8, 2020 During modifications to my filler neck, I had a 10mm(?) thick flange welded to the side of the tank and the pump now bolts up to this. It was just too easy to distort the tank when tightening the pump bolts and this solves part of the problem. The fuel pump cradle can also be distorted by overtightening but that would be more difficult. It's not a good design is it..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7 wonders of the world Posted February 8, 2020 Share Posted February 8, 2020 If I ever have any pump issue I will modify the tank and run an external Bosch 044 pump mounted on the rear bulkhead - god knows why I didn't go that route when I rebuilt her The Rover pump cradles are no longer available and it always struck me as something design by Wallace and Grommit ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SM25T Posted February 8, 2020 Share Posted February 8, 2020 That's what Chris Wheeler did for me last year. New plate on end of tank, with a rigid tube welded into it, to act as a pick up. Filter before and after an external pump mounted on the bulkhead behind the driver seat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted February 8, 2020 Author Share Posted February 8, 2020 Are the Rover cradles available from anywhere, eg Redline if the cradle face is distorted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7 wonders of the world Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 I didn't find one after trying all the known 7 sources and the Rover parts dealers too, if you do grab it, and then go buy a lottery ticket too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team SLR No.77 Posted February 9, 2020 Leadership Team Share Posted February 9, 2020 An external pump would also mean a filtered pickup could be located low down in the center of the tank which would give better tank capacity.Stu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7 wonders of the world Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 You may need to look at the tank as the K tank has trap doors to accomadate the in tank pump location in the right hand third of the tank.ISTR the VX race tank took the outlet from te lower front face running 3/8" into the pump, not sure on the internal pick up placement or weather it was filtered or not, but the 044 should be prefiltered anyway and these filters are usually stripable with a 100 micron gauze. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted February 13, 2020 Author Share Posted February 13, 2020 Fuel pump out and the Gasket looks ok, with no degradation whatsoever and the Blue hylomar is still present. Interestingly some Fasteners were not as tight as others & the rivnut threads were furred up with Ali oxide. I think I’ve lost threads & the bolts have loosened. There is some irregularity in the mating face apparent but it’s not extensive. The first step I think should be to drill out and replace the blind rivnuts first, as a cheaper alternative to replacing the tank. Does anyone know the spec of blind rivnut I need, or am I best ringing Arch tomorrow.I found some here, but not sure what I need. https://www.rivetwise.co.uk/rivets/rivet-nuts.asp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Jonathan Kay Posted February 13, 2020 Member Share Posted February 13, 2020 The first step I think should be to drill out and replace the blind rivnuts...Is the tank drained and are the fumes flushed out?Jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted February 13, 2020 Author Share Posted February 13, 2020 It’s drained and outside in the fresh air to vent. I won’t be doing it for several days, I’ll need to identify the right parts to order, so hoeofully it will be Ok when I get to it. Any suggestions on how to force ventilate, or will it all evaporate over a few days? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Jonathan Kay Posted February 13, 2020 Member Share Posted February 13, 2020 That's good to hear.:-)One common method is to fill it with liquid water. (I think that I saw steam used in a TV programme recently.)Jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECR Posted February 14, 2020 Share Posted February 14, 2020 Running exhaust fumes into it is also suggested... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted February 14, 2020 Author Share Posted February 14, 2020 Hi, I've done water in the past, but that was when I had straightforward access to a manhole drain to get rid of the water! I think Ill just leave it outside for a week. Given the wind forecast this weekend, it should be well vented! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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